Irish Mountain
Running Association


Forum Messages

Brían O'MearaMay 2 2012, 3:45pmI'm willing to summit marshal this, if a summit marshal is needed.
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 8 2012, 1:40pmHi Brían, Excellent! You have the job. Thanks for volunteering! Cait
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 8 2012, 1:51pmHi all,
For the Brockagh race on 30MAY12, the Defence Forces wish to host the event as a means of saying thanks to IMRA for all the wonderful races held over the years. We are however, without a laptop operator and would greatly appreciate the help of a volunteer who has the laptop operators course done to assist us. Of course, any runners/non-runners who also wish to assist for this event is more than welcome!
Thank you,
Caitríona Nic Cába,
Karl MaguireMay 23 2012, 3:36pmI'm also available to Marshal Caitriona!
Pádraig FitzpatrickMay 24 2012, 10:18amI can't run for a few weeks so i'm also available.
Sam ScrivenMay 24 2012, 10:35amCaitriona. I think it was mentioned in the race briefing last night that you were looking for a First Aider for next week. There is one listed already in the event details. I can only make up the seven league races if I run, but can offer assistance at the finish as a running first aider if this is any use. Sam
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 24 2012, 11:39amWe are already covered. Michael Blighe has volunteered as First Aid Officer for this event. Thanks for volunteering though and enjoy the run!
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 24 2012, 11:44amKarl and Pádraig, Thanks for volunteering.

NOTE TO ALL VOLUNTEERS: There will be a brief for all volunteers at the Resource Centre Brickagh at 1800HRS SHARP, where you will be tasked with your responsibilities for the evening. Please arrive in good time. See you there. Caitriona

NOTE TO EARLY START RUNNERS: There will be an early start available at 1910HRS SHARP for runners over 160% Winning time. This will start at the same position as the main race, on the laneway by the shop in Laragh.
Donal TroddynMay 24 2012, 9:43pmCatriona, I had said yesterday I'd do First Aid for you, but I take it you're covered now with Michael?
Michael BligheMay 24 2012, 11:57pmAll,

I'm happy to do first aid, but I won't get there until about 7.

Caitriona - is that ok? I know you're instructions are for all volunteers
to be there by 6, so I don't want to create any difficulties for you.

Caitriona Nic CabaMay 25 2012, 12:02pmHi Donal, Thanks, sorry about the mix up, yes we are covered for first aid. Michael can cover it

Hi Michael, Yes 7pm is fine for you to arrive. Hopefully nobody will need it before then, :)

See you next week
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 25 2012, 12:15pmNOTE TO ALL VOLUNTEERS:
I am in need of a person to do Junior Turn around. Anyone want the job?
Justin O'KeeffeMay 27 2012, 2:45pmNo problem - just volunteered
Dermot MurphyMay 28 2012, 9:09amPLEASE NOTE - PERMIT FROM THE NATIONAL PARKS HAS BEEN RECEIVED SUBJECT TO A MAXIMUM NUMBER OF 150 RUNNERS. Registration will close when this cap of 150 has been reached. Please do not run on the course if you do make it to registration on time or before the cap is reached.
Mick HanneyMay 28 2012, 12:14pmHas something changed here? We haven't had runner limits on any races before. Maybe our races are becoming too popular :-)

This is where online entry would come into its own. On the basis of last week's numbers there is potential for 100 runners not be able to run but having turned up. Its a long way to travel to to find out you haven't made the cap. No easy answers to this either. Also, if people aren't in the race but want to run on the route we can't prevent that.
Mike LongMay 28 2012, 1:56pmCaitriona
I see you have loads of volunteers for Wed but if you need one more I will add my name.
Stuart ScottMay 28 2012, 3:25pmI don't know the specifics behind this one, but a cap on numbers was long expected. For any areas with a high potential for erosion or destruction of habitats, the WMNP commonly impose a limit of 50 people. So 150 is fairly generous. I think the worst thing we can do is run the route anyway if we miss the cutoff, and those who do run should keep to the path and already eroded sections.

As Glendo is such a central location, how about an unofficial race on a nearby mountain for those who miss out? An option could be a loop of Derrybawn, Mullacor and Lugduff East. It would be a decent recce for anyone hoping to do the forthcoming Circuit of Glendo.
Dermot MurphyMay 28 2012, 3:38pmJust to fill in on the reason the cap - the National Parks told me there is another event on Brokagh earlier in the day, so they felt a cap was needed for our race. Cannot be helped unfortunately.

Good suggestion by Stuart to have an unofficial run nearby if people miss the cap. Plenty of good trails in the Glendalough area.
John DoyleMay 28 2012, 4:34pmsurely this race should be switched to another date then,one that doesnt clash with another event
Alan AylingMay 28 2012, 5:03pmVery close to the event for making a change like that John, when the organisers have already put a lot of preparation in, got volunteers ready etc. It's unfortunate but I can't see a better solution myself at this stage.

A suggestion though: seeing as there seemed to be substantial liberties taken with the early start last week, how about only one start for Brockagh, with the cap on numbers?
Dermot MurphyMay 28 2012, 6:13pmChanging the date not possible at this stage.

Re early starts - the whole point of offering early starts is that volunteers are not hanging around too long for all the runners to finish, especially the summit marshal who may not get back down until its nearly dark. So early starts are to be encouraged in longer races WHEN NEEDED - hence the 160% rule. I was not at the race last week myself - apparently quite a few took the early start but only 2 results were changed - so I think that race had a successful application of the rule.

Early starts wont make any difference to the 150 cap...
Niamh O CeallaighMay 28 2012, 9:53pmTo continue on Alan's tangent...
If all the 160% people had done the early start last week, there would have been 90 starting early. That would have been a nice mess! Percentages were skewed because of the bottleknecks - a disadvantage the early starters did not have to contend with.
Angus TynerMay 29 2012, 6:53amAnd to add to early start debate.
I was at summit last week.

The 2nd last finisher was 2nd last to summit and started in main race. I can't remember who was last to summit some minutes later.

The early start made absolutely no difference as to when I got to leave the summit because the slowest started in main race anyway.

So what's the point of early start?
It can't be ensured that everyone of the slowest runners takes the early start
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 29 2012, 9:40amHi Dermot,
Do you know who I can ring about the prize vouchers? They were not supplied in the race directors kit. Thanks
Dermot MurphyMay 29 2012, 9:46amCaitriona, I have them and will bring them with me to the race.
Feilim BorlandMay 29 2012, 11:01amHi all,

Any chance I could get a lift back to Dublin with someone leaving straight after the race?

Colin DoyleMay 29 2012, 11:03am@Feilim,
Hi there ill be heading straight back if you want a lift.
no is 0863445554
ciaran kellyMay 29 2012, 12:49pm@Felim,, Referance Colins kind offer of a lift back to Dublin...
Ive seen Colins navigation skills at first hand, so if ur not in a hurry & would like to take in alot more country side than expected, uve got the right man !!! ... lol... Just kidding...

Looking forward to the

Rebecca JacobsonMay 29 2012, 2:01pmHi all,
I'm looking into tomorrow night's run and just wondered if there is much navigating or off trail bits. I see the level is 2 'moderate'. My fitness level is quite good (have just completed a road marathon) and have done a few spinc runs so have a tiny bit of hill experience but not much. I'm not very good with off trail or navigating though... is anyone familiar with the route who could give me a bit more details about the level of difficulty? i.e. will I get lost or have to traverse a river?!
Many thanks!
Ronan HickeyMay 29 2012, 2:08pmRebecca, you'll be absolutely fine. If you look in the race marking section of the Event details you will see that it is fully marked. No navigation is required at all. Just lifting your head enough to see the next sign or piece of ribbon! :-)

As to the off-trail bits you'll be grand. As far as I remember it's pretty much small mud-tracks and some wider trail. You'll be fine. Wear grippy shoes if you have them and if you don't just take it handy on the descents.

Come along, it's a great route and I think you'll love it. Don't forget the cap on numbers though. so get there early and if you print off the membership form and have it filled out all will go even more swimmingly!

Enjoy it!

Padraig FitzpatrickMay 29 2012, 2:50pmHi,
Would someone be able to invite me to myimra so i could use the carpool feature.

Donal TroddynMay 29 2012, 3:00pmPadraig, I can invite you - I just need your e-mail address. You can sent it to
Padraig FitzpatrickMay 29 2012, 3:21pmThanks Donal, email sent.
Cormac O ceallaighMay 29 2012, 6:18pmThis opens a wider debate.I am against a cap .The mountains and trails are to be enjoyed .The designated paths are there for a purpose.The popularity of the mountains has only taken off in recent years.I recall my hill walking days from over 10 yrs ago and many was the time you would be lucky to meet someone on a day in the mountains!
What's the difference between our race and say 5/6 different groups of hill walkers doing this walk on a Sunday whose numbers may very well combined exceed 150?
What next - will they be sending in the choppers to monitor the event!
180 runners took part in this race last year ,and with the fine dry weather I would expect that this would well be exceeded tomorrow.
I appreciate the committee and Dermot put in Trojan work trying to oversee and organise a packed calendar and perhaps some of our new members may have the time and the capacity to take up this cause further.
Rebecca JacobsonMay 29 2012, 11:12pmHi!
Thanks for the response Ronan, I think I'll give it a try! If I can get a lift that is...

Can anyone give me a lift from Dublin? (Blackrock or anywhere)

Many thanks.
John BarryMay 30 2012, 8:54amRebecca,

I'll be leaving from Blackrock Business park (Carlsford Ave) at 5:15-5:30 if you want a lift.

Zero 8 Seven 60five 80Nine 5

Niamh O CeallaighMay 30 2012, 10:25amHi,
What time will registration open tonight? Just want to make sure I don't miss out!
Jesko ZimmermannMay 30 2012, 11:08amHi all,

Could anybody give me a lift from Dublin? (Centre or any Luas/Dart stop)

Many thanks,
Khai LeeMay 30 2012, 1:09pmI'll be leaving Crumlin Children's Hospital shortly after 17:00 if anyone wants a ride down this evening.
Jesko ZimmermanMay 30 2012, 2:40pm@ Daniela Boehm: I just booked a seat with you in the car pool but didn't get a confirmation e-mail, so I just wanted to ask if you can confirm the seat.

Daniela BoehmMay 30 2012, 3:36pmHi Jesko,
yeah no problem, you have the seat:) we are leaving from the car park in front of the engineering building in UCD (when you enter the campus from N11, follow the road to the left, then first car park on the right). My number is zero86201six784. Cu then
jason melvinMay 30 2012, 4:56pmHi all,

Is there going to be an unofficial race nearby for anyone that doesn't make it into the first 150 this evening? Plan on driving out from stillorgan at about 5.45, so should be there by 6.30?

Brendan LawlorMay 30 2012, 5:05pmJason, note on the home page from Kevin, so yes it looks likely (assuming more than 150 turn up of course!)

Tuesday May 29 - Kevin O'Riordan
In case people missed it on the Events page/forum, the National Parks and Wildlife service have imposed a cap of 150 runners at this race due to another event taking place earlier in the day. Places will be first come first served so try to arrive early and possibly reconsider if you have to make a long journey to get to the race.

There are some plans to run an unofficial run on other trails in the vicinity for people who arrive and miss the cutoff. Keep an eye on the forum for details.
Mick HanneyMay 31 2012, 1:00amRemaining photos will follow tomorrow evening
Brendan LawlorMay 31 2012, 9:00amGreat event last night - well done Caitriona and all her team , a fine debut at organising races. The Cap was imposed and the sky didn't fall in so there is a sustainable future for us (and I had my first top 100 LL finish in about two years!)
Ronan HickeyMay 31 2012, 10:00amReally well run race, and the side effect of the cap was that as we all got there very early it was probably the most relaxed and chilled out preparation for a race I've been at!

@Rebecca, I see you made it on the night. Hope you enjoyed your first (of many?) IMRA races!

John KellyMay 31 2012, 10:55amDidn't make the first 150 runners last night and am a bit dissapointed as that was going to be my first race that I had done twice. ( The Djoice race a couple off weeks ago changed route to anticlockwise).
Arriving at about 6.50 pm I thought I would be ok but alas no!I wonder if a cap is going to be imposed on imra going forward?
Depending on work commitments people might miss every race where a limit is imposed on imra. Although last night it was the best way of doing it going forward first come first served isn't the fairest way of doing it. If this becomes a feature of hill running events perhaps volunteering records should be taken into account for entry into limited races.

Ian BailyMay 31 2012, 11:43am@John, 152 runners last night. Were you 153? If the cap is 150, make it 150. Do two juniors make a senior? Maybe you could have run the junior route?

Only way forward is online registration. Where races have a cap, possibly less cars. Could also pay for car park online then if you want to recoup any money it's up to you to give people a lift for a nominal fee.
Peter O'FarrellMay 31 2012, 11:50amIt might not be the fairest approach but it's certainly the easiest for the race director and has the brucie bonus effect of having race registration all wrapped up at 6.50pm - giving the beleagured laptop operator ample time to input the details before 7.30pm. All good? Mostly good?

Well done to all involved anyway, and also those not involved - when I got there at 7pm there was a complete lack of shouting, whinging or moaning going on, although Brendan Lawlor was patrolling the gates in a very military fashion :)
Paul O'OMay 31 2012, 12:52pmIf you read the forum you would have been well informed of the cutoff and the reasons for the cutoff.
Mick FalMay 31 2012, 1:33pmFantastic Paul, Ill just sit and refresh an internet forum for a limitation that has never been set before.
Ronan HickeyMay 31 2012, 1:48pmMick, in fairness IMRA didn't choose to impose this restriction. It was imposed on them by the rules of the permit. And as (I assume) the permit was only received close to the race date there wasn't a chance to let everybody know well in advance. However it was announced on the forum at 9am on the 28th and also put on the front page of the IMRA website a day later.

Is there something you would prefer them to have done? Spend the money texting runners who might or mightn't be running and couldn't be bothered keeping an eye on the website? Or perhaps ignore the rules of the permit, thus possibly risking being barred from further permits and forcing race cancellations?

As far as I can see IMRA did everything it was possible for them to do in an unfortunate situation. But if you have suggestions for how it could have been handled better please do share them here.

Donal TroddynMay 31 2012, 1:50pmMick, what would you suggest? The race page is always where the info about any race is given. The cut-off was announced as soon as it was known. Shouldn't that be enough? What would be enough for you? A text message to all members? A registered letter? A runner? An announcement after the Six-One news?

How did you find out about the race in the first place, if not from the web page?
Mick FalMay 31 2012, 2:11pmThis is not my first Brockagh or Leinster league and the routes are all familiar and my group do not need to car pool, we organise that ourselves. The only reason I would check the website is every few weeks to check what the next 2-3 races are. As I said I know the routes, I know how to get there. I dont to need to forensically check this website. At the very least, for such a occurrence I would have expected a text or email. Group webtexts are free and effective. Emails are still free!

You can call the six-one news if you like captain smug.
Michael StokerMay 31 2012, 2:21pmMick, I'm not the administrator but can I ask you if you wouldn't mind being a bit more polite to your running peers on the forum. I'd also add that my own view on this would be that it is reasonable to expect runners to recheck the details of any race just prior to the event as last minute changes are not unheard of. I'm not sure your 'expecting' at least an email or text quite goes with either the IMRA community ethos or the spirit of self-sufficiency on the hills. That being said, I rather like the idea of a group text facility - but don't feel entitled to one being created.
Paul O'OMay 31 2012, 2:24pmgroup texts, email, etc all come with an overhead. I would imagine that grown adults dont need to be spoonfed information espcially if thay know the race page and forum is the source of any information they need.
Hazel ThompsonMay 31 2012, 2:26pmSign up to the Forum and you will get all the group texts you want :-)
Kevin O'RiordanMay 31 2012, 2:29pm" At the very least, for such a occurrence I would have expected a text or email. Group webtexts are free and effective. Emails are still free!"

You sure you wouldn't want the message hand delivered and read out to you while you're at it? You know what else is free and effective? Checking the website before the race. Why should others have to do extra work because some are too lazy to do something so simple. Also, to echo what Hazel said, you can subscribe to the forum so all messages arrive in your inbox so heaven forbid, you don't have to open a new browser tab to see them.
Fergus ByrneMay 31 2012, 2:38pmHazel that was the most logical comment on this tread since about mid morning! And I got it direct to my iPhone. I wonder how that happened?????? ;)
Stuart ScottMay 31 2012, 2:59pmMick, it's important for everyone to check the website in the run-up to a race. Last night was a case in point I think! For other races, important safety information (such as a kit requirement) is usually published this way too. And of course there's the continual threat of a race being cancelled at the last minute due to a volunteer shortage (Scarr last year being a good example as you probably know).

Not being facetious but is there actually a way of texting 2,000 people for free?
Hazel ThompsonMay 31 2012, 4:14pmBack to the question of early starters.

I saw a lot of people on their way back the mountain very early on in the race - shortly after I had passed the junior turning point. There was no way that they were eligible early satrters and I see at least one of them with a result of <140%. If you to run in a race and are that fit, why start early - you may as well just be out for a run in the hills.
Caitriona Nic CabaMay 31 2012, 4:16pmA MESSAGE FROM BROCKAGH RACE DIRECTOR

Thanks to all volunteers who helped out last night. Your combined effort and enthusiasm made for a very successful event.

Thanks to all runners who participated, and apologies to those who arrived after the cap of 150 runners was full. I am sure you can appreciate that we must comply with WMNP regulations/instructions to ensure that future events are supported as well as they have been over the years from WMNP.

Please be assured that last minute changes to race details are posted on the race forum and to check online for same before departing for a race. Lets not forget the friendly IMRA ethos that goes with being a member of this club. The Forum should be used as a positive means of communication and lets leave it at that (see IMRA netiquettte policy).

See you all out on the hills,


Mick FalMay 31 2012, 4:19pmYou mean after the cap of 152 was filled.
miguel SanchezMay 31 2012, 4:24pm@(Mick Fal)quit being a bitch.
John DunneMay 31 2012, 4:28pmHey Mick Fal, if your're not happy with the race and the way its run maybe dont go anymore, it was stated that you needed to be there early, clearly you were late, maybe you should purchase a watch?...or were you trying to improve your running time by not wearing one?...Stop being a lazy grumpy complaing moaning fool and be on time next time!!
Eoin KeithMay 31 2012, 4:40pm<webaster hat on>
Can you all stop making personal attacks on people please. Critique the post, not the poster.
Pat ByrneMay 31 2012, 4:44pmWell said Eoin, no need for that Mick Fal
Torben DahlMay 31 2012, 4:58pmInstead of giving out you should rather appreciate that a lot of volunteers are putting a lot of time and effort in to run these great IMRA races. Of course people got disappointed if they didn’t make the 150 cap last night, who wouldn’t, but come on there are so many other IMRA races and a cap yesterday doesn’t necessarily mean there will be a cap at other races!

And if this so called Mick Fal claims he has run a number of IMRA races, I wonder if he ran under another name? I can’t find any of that name on the runners list. If you’re giving out your view at least you can stand up under your full or real name. 150 or 152 runners, what’s the big deal, the cut was made and again it’s all pen and paper registration so why bother that 2 more made it into the race? The day IMRA turns into a privately owned professional event company that makes profit you can start giving out about the organization.
Alan MaddenMay 31 2012, 5:23pmBuild a bridge "Mick" and run over it, someday.

Great set up last night, and what scenery - Love it.
Very chilled build up too. Roll on next week.

P.S. I am pretty new to the races, so just to let some of you know that I leave from Ballsbridge/Donnybrook area each Wednesday and usually have room for 2 bums on seats, possibly more some weeks. Happy to help out anyone living/working nearby.
Mick Fal (original)May 31 2012, 5:39pmLads, I posted twice today. Once at 1:33 and once at 2:11. On a warning of politeness I decided to stop posting. Some joker has taken my signature and posted again. That was not me. Any name can be chosen for posting.

Any doubts, have admin check the email of the posts. I will not post again so anymore 'Mick Fal' will not be me.
Jeff FitzsimonsMay 31 2012, 6:28pmOn a positive note, congratulations to Torben on what I belive was his first IMRA win.

Hopefully he decides to quit while he's ahead and give the rest of us a chance of similar glory.
John LawrenceMay 31 2012, 8:26pmJust to comment on early starting - I'm typically a 140/150% runner in the races I have run this year but found the start very tight on a few of the races, scalp and carrig so thought it would be better to try early start on this one ! Although I admit it is not as enjoyable as running with a big group around, at least you get a good run and don't get stuck behind slower runners and can't get past when its narrow ! Perhaps on some of the races with a narrow start the 160% could be reduced so there would be more ppl in the early start so everyone in both races are a bit more spread out ?? Just a thought ??
Dermot MurphyMay 31 2012, 8:54pmJohn, thats not what we are trying to achieve with the early starts. Its the fact that there is more room on the path for the early starters that many people are actually against the early starts. 160% is to stop people taking the early start who do not need it.
Maeve O'Grady May 31 2012, 9:20pmWell done Caitriona on first race as race director! Good job:-)
Mick HanneyMay 31 2012, 10:17pmRemaining photos eventually up. The upload process still breaks my heart every time.
Christopher DunneMay 31 2012, 11:47pmI unfortunately arrived after the 150 cut off point, but due to the fact that I arrived there to do a run, myself and 5 others did a run up Scarr. Surely if you made the effort to get to Laragh, even without checking the website for last minute notices, you went there to run. The reason you joined IMRA in the first place was to run in the mountains, so why not just do it!!
Hazel ThompsonJun 1 2012, 11:59amJohn, that's my point exactly. If you are out to run a race, surely you should run it under the same conditions as everyone else, instead of getting an advantage by starting early and not having to deal with congestion in certain parts of the route. If you start early, you are basically just going for a run in the hills - you aren't in the race... The reason for starting early is, as Rachel said in a seperate thread, to avoid the helpers having to spend all night on the hills.

Maybe the organisers still have to check the early starter list to apply the 160% rule for this race...
Kevin O'RiordanJun 1 2012, 12:01pmHi Hazel,

I haven't checked the early starters list yet. Will do so this evening.

John KellyJun 1 2012, 1:50pmJust a thought. If you add time to early starters who are outside the 160% cutoff won't they benefit in the Handycap race later in the season?
John LawrenceJun 1 2012, 5:56pmIt seems to be a bit of a conflict if "The reason for starting early is, as Rachel said in a seperate thread, to avoid the helpers having to spend all night on the hills." so therefore by sending more ppl out on the early start then everyone will be finished a bit earlier as there would be less conjestion for the normal time starters and everyone would finish a bit earlier ! I think this would only work perfectly if you can be sure that all the <160% ppl are in the early start which is not possible !
Anyway in saying all this I have to say I really enjoy the races - The set-up, maps, results, photos, forum, carpooling, volunteering, marking, etc is really well run and ppl obviously put a lot of time and effort into it and long may it continue - I am certainly not giving out and the rules that are there Im sure have been thought/argued about before now and been there long before me :)

Torben DahlJun 4 2012, 10:18amRace Report now up ;)
Ronan HickeyJun 4 2012, 11:19amGreat report. That should go in the next IMRA annual!
Mick HanneyJun 4 2012, 1:04pmNice one Torben. Dont wait so long for your next report. :-)
Jeff FitzsimonsJun 4 2012, 10:58pmTo paraphrase a popular football chant, Torben: Write when you're winning, you only write when you're winning, write when you're wiiiinnning!!!

I doubt it will be so long until the next one, well done.
Rene BorgJun 7 2012, 8:48pmTeam results are up.